Ramayana vs mang odoy: Trinitas meniru paganisme.

mang odoy wrote:ampyunnnn dahhh pak Rama ini.....kok malah mewek mewek pengen DIAKHIRI...bentar duluu dongg....udah mau SERU SERU nya nihh.....sabar sabarr...tar juga kebagean...

Mau 5 hari kek..mau satu minggu kek...itu hak saya...ngapain mesti koar koar..??? nyantei aja lahh...toh kita bukan lagi Perlombaan 17 Agustus..

ramayana wrote:ya elah mang mang..

udah ane kasih link ente ga mau tau!

ane harus cari lagi.. ane males tau!

ane kasih clue.. saat bait suci di hancurkan tahun 70 an, yang jaga adalah grup pertama. ente google deh.

itulah dasar kalau kelahiran late december!

dan itu ketemu bisa tanggal 25 desember!

pada tahun 400an, ada rohaniawan yang menulis kalau perhitungan tanggal 25 desember itu benar. dasarnya apa? ya karena ada catatan yg mengatakan kalau grup pertama jaga saat penghancuran kuil suci oleh romawi.

ente cari deh kapan itu terjadi.

ini ada catatan, atau ada risalah, atau ada fakta tertulis!

sedang versi yang lain hanya berdasar akan perkiraan.

mengenai musim dingin..

ada catatan di awal abad juga yang mengatakan kalau gembala mengembala di musim dingin. kenapa? emang musim dingin kambing domba ga makan ya? terus makan apa?

apalagi hanya 9 derajat.

http://natal25desember.com/tag/musim-hujan-bukan-musim-dingin-es-salju-tebal/

tuh ada sedikit penjelasannya.. apa? masih kurang?? hahahahaha.. ini kisah nyatanya!

Here is an interesting experience from Dr. Harry Mulder of the Netherlands.
During the brief Christmas vacation my wife and I traveled from Beirut to Jerusalem . . . On Christmas Eve in Shepherd Field a crowd had gathered to sing Christmas carols. We joined this crowd and took part in the singing. Right near us a few flocks of sheep nestled. Even the lambs were not lacking. It was a moving sight. It is therefore definitely not impossible that the Lord Jesus was born in December.[1]

http://www.neverthirsty.org/pp/corner/read1/r00372.html

"HANYA KOBOY KAMBING YANG GILA..DAN GAK ADA KERJAAN...MENGGEMBALAKAN KAMBINGNYA DI MALAM HARI DI SAAT SUHU BERADA PADA TITIK 9 DERAJAT CELCIUS..!!"

hahahaha.. koboy BEG00 ya mang.. hahahahaha..

ente kan ngaku udah ke jerusalem.. mbok kesana pas christmas eve..
biar lihat sendiri hahahaha..

ane dah buktikan tuduhan ente itu fitnah.. dari tanggal sampai ibu perawan. ane tau ente ga bisa mikir, jadi asal njeplak tulisan orang.

lha tulisan udah ane buktikan ngawur, ente ga mau terima.

sekarang malah fitnah lagi bilang akidah kiristen niru pagan.

mana??????

mosok udah fitnah, masih nunggu kumpulin bahan? hahahahaha

mang odoy wrote:!

Apa hubungannya..???
Gak usah PELIT...bawa aja KISAH nya dimari...
Buktikan bahwa kejadian taun 70 masehi itu adalah DASAR KUAT penentuan AHIR DESEMBER sebagai kelahiran Yesus..
Kenapa tidak berdasar kan BIBLE..???
Anda kan sudah bawa sendiri link yang ini..??

What is important to this discussion is that according to both Josephus (Jewish historian, AD 37 – c. 100) and more recent work done by Friedlieb (Leben J. Christi des Erlösers, Münster, 1887, p. 312), it was the First Course that was serving at the time of the destruction of the Second Temple in A.D. 70 — in the second week of Av.

Belum tentu...anda cuman ngoceh sendiri...kaya preman kalah maen togel di pinggir alun alun....silahkan bedah dan jelaskan dimari..
Sanggup...??

Yang namanya cuaca...kalo siang dingin...malam pasti tambah dingin..
Daerah Betlehem itu emang gak kena salju...tapi yang namanya musim dingin di negara Eropa yang gak kena salju...walo siang hari matahari bersinar dengan cerah dan langit berwarna Biru , tetep aja dinginnya minta ampun....saya pernah ngalamin itu...waktu kapal saya masih di Laut Mediteranean sampe ahir November, daerah yang saya kunjungi adalah YUNANI-ITALY-SPANYOL....dinginnya dah minta ampun..padahal siang hari..gimana kalo AHIR DESEMBER...???
Makanya saya katakan KOBOY GILA kalo pas AHIR DESEMBER, gembalain kambing di MALAM HARI....

Anda ini gak bisa asal ngoceh pak...saya tuh dah sering bolak balik ke daerah Mediteranean yang notabene JALUR SEJARAH KRISTEN semuah...

Baru muter muter di Nusantara aja dah sok tau...!!

Suhu rata-rata daerah Palestina
Suhu tertinggi jatuh pada bulan Juni atau Juli, sedangkan suhu terendah jatuh pada bulan Januari atau Februari. Suhu rata-rata bulan Desember lebih rendah ketimbang bulan Juni atau Juli, tetapi lebih tinggi ketimbang bulan Januari atau Februari.

Suhu berdampak pada curah hujan. Suhu rata-rata yang lebih tinggi dari 18 derajat
Celsius membawa curah hujan yang rendah, sehingga mengakibatkan bulan-bulan kemarau.
Rata-rata suhu yang rendah, yaitu antara 9 sampai 18 derajat Celcius membawa curah hujan yang tinggi, sehingga mengakibatkan bulan-bulan penghujan. Curah hujan berhubungan erat dengan rumput. Perhatikan rumput dan postur hewan dalam bulan hujan dalam klip yang diambil di padang Betlehem.

Domba pada bulan Desember di Betlehem gemuk-gemuk karena melimpahnya rerumputan yang bergizi tinggi




Saya berani katakan bahwa ARTIKEL DIATAS adalah BOHONG...!!
Ketika saya mengunjungi JERUSALEM dan BETLEHEM (jarak Betlehem dari Jerusalem sekitar 10 Km)..... dan waktu itu adalah AHIR OKTOBER....cuaca emang sudah sedikit SEJUK... Daerah Betlehem ini berbukit bukit, dan bukan tanah datar apalagi ada padang rumput...tanah yang kering bercampur kerikil...hanya memungkinkan TANAMAN BUAH ZAITUN yang tumbuh..dan emang...Buah Zaitun banyak tumbuh di Betlehem..


Artikel sih boleh aja ngambil dari mana mana...tapi kalo bicara JERUSALEM dan BETLEHEM...saya sudah menginjakkan kaki disana...

Halfway there, we passed a young shepherd by the side of the road watching a small flock of sheep on a hill. We decided we needed a break so climbed the hill, said “Hi” to the shepherd, and sat down to eat some snacks.

I think we all thought it was quite funny to actually see sheep and a shepherd in this otherwise developed area. 2,000 years and some things haven’t changed!

Taun berapa mereka maen ke Betlehem...???
Apakah CUACA dari jaman Yesus sampe sekarang TETAP...???

Perakiraan cuaca yang dibuat di abad Milenium aja ngatain begini..
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bethlehem

Climate
Bethlehem has a Mediterranean climate, with hot and dry summers and cold winters. Winter temperatures (mid-December to mid-March) can be cold and rainy. January is the coldest month, with temperatures ranging from 1 to 13 degree Celsius (33–55 °F). From May through September, the weather is warm and sunny. August is the hottest month, with a high of 30 degrees Celsius (81 °F). Bethlehem receives an average of 700 millimeters (28 in) of rainfall annually, 70% between November and January.[52]

Data diatas adalah penjelasan cuaca yang dibuat pada abad Milinium...apalagi 2000 tahun yang lalu ketika jaman Yesus masih idup...cuaca bisa lebih ekstrim lagi..

AHIR DESEMBER dengan cuaca yang TERAMAT SANGAT DINGIN....para koboy koboy menggembalakan kambingnya dimalam hari...???

Sungguh suatu PENDAPAT YANG DIPAKSAKAN hanya untuk MEMPERTAHANKAN IMAN yang.......RAPUH...!!!

Tetep aja...pengalaman saya ketika sampe AHIR NOVEMBER kapal masih sailing di Laut Mediteranean....siang hari dengan langit biru dan matahari bersinar cerah....DINGINNYA DAH MINTA AMPUN...
Apalagi AHIR DESEMBER pas malam hari...

Cuman KOBOY KAMBING YANG GILA yang gembalain kambing pada AHIR DESEMBER....MALAM hari pulaaa...

Masalah tanggal emang bukan hal yang mendasar...yang jadi ACUAN UTAMA adalha...bahwa TOKOH TOKOH PAGAN DILAHIRKAN pada WINTER SOLTICE...yaitu kalo diitung dengan penanggalan Masehi yang berlaku sekarang antara tanggal 21-24 Desember.

Tokoh tokoh Pagan yang hidup ribuan taun sebelum Yesus...tentunya gak pake Kalender Masehi...tapi SAAT WINTER SOLTICE itulah yang jadi acuannya...dan kelahiran Yesus inipun...diperingati pada 25 Desember adalah WINTER SOLTICE...

Masalah WINTER SOLTICE inilah yang coba anda HINDARKAN untuk dibahas...

Saya bukan MEMFITNAH...tapi sekedar BERBAGI INFORMASI...bahwa AKIDAH KRISTEN adalah COMOTAN DARI PAGANISME....
Dan referensi yang saya ambil pun bukan dari kalangan Muslim...

Selama anda MAMPU UNTUK BERTAHAN...silahkan BANTAH BUKTI BUKTI SEJARAH yang akan saya sodorkan terkait AKIDAH PAGANISME yang dipake Kristen...

Biar pembaca yang menilainya....INFORMASI KEPAGANAN dari "mang odoy"....atow bantahan dari "ramayana"...

kan gitu..??

hayoooo...RAMAYANA SANG JAGOAN...maju lagii ahhh.....si SEGOROWEDI dan OGLIKOM dah mulai NGACAY di lapak sebelah...sekarang giliran nt lagi yang kena KEFYET MIYING nya "mang odoy"....


tarriiikkk jjabbbriigggg....!!!

mang odoy wrote:!

Apa hubungannya..???
Gak usah PELIT...bawa aja KISAH nya dimari...
Buktikan bahwa kejadian taun 70 masehi itu adalah DASAR KUAT penentuan AHIR DESEMBER sebagai kelahiran Yesus..
Kenapa tidak berdasar kan BIBLE..???
Anda kan sudah bawa sendiri link yang ini..??

ente kelihatan kalau ga bisa cari sendiri hehehehehe..

What is important to this discussion is that according to both Josephus (Jewish historian, AD 37 – c. 100) and more recent work done by Friedlieb (Leben J. Christi des Erlösers, Münster, 1887, p. 312), it was the First Course that was serving at the time of the destruction of the Second Temple in A.D. 70 — in the second week of Av.

http://www.missionendeavors.org/Santa/About_the_Season/Entries/2011/12/20_The_Biblical_Case_for_a_Late-December_Christmas.html

bukannya ane udah kasih kalau ada dasar tenteng late december. silahkan ente ngitung.. bisa?

akhir desember bukan dari bible?? emang adanya perayaan natal dari bible ya? hahahahahaha..

Belum tentu...anda cuman ngoceh sendiri...kaya preman kalah maen togel di pinggir alun alun....silahkan bedah dan jelaskan dimari..
Sanggup...??

mang.. ane udah tau kualitas ente.. bedah ama ente sama sekali ga nambah ilmu.
ngabisin waktu percuma. ane udah kasih tau kalau lahir 25 december itu ada dasarnya.
ente koar koar minta di bedah? hahahahahahaaha..

yang lebih penting, buktikan akidah kristen sama kayak pagan. kita ketemu juga di trit ente islam itu pagan.

Yang namanya cuaca...kalo siang dingin...malam pasti tambah dingin..
Daerah Betlehem itu emang gak kena salju...tapi yang namanya musim dingin di negara Eropa yang gak kena salju...walo siang hari matahari bersinar dengan cerah dan langit berwarna Biru , tetep aja dinginnya minta ampun....saya pernah ngalamin itu...waktu kapal saya masih di Laut Mediteranean sampe ahir November, daerah yang saya kunjungi adalah YUNANI-ITALY-SPANYOL....dinginnya dah minta ampun..padahal siang hari..gimana kalo AHIR DESEMBER...???
Makanya saya katakan KOBOY GILA kalo pas AHIR DESEMBER, gembalain kambing di MALAM HARI....

Anda ini gak bisa asal ngoceh pak...saya tuh dah sering bolak balik ke daerah Mediteranean yang notabene JALUR SEJARAH KRISTEN semuah...

Baru muter muter di Nusantara aja dah sok tau...!!

hehehehehe.. yang jadi kuli kapal udah sombong! terserah lah mang.. ane ga usah buktikan parport ane.
kita bicara betlehem. kok ke italy hahahahahaha.. sing @#$%^ sopo mang?

ente pikir domba di new zealand gimana?

udah ane kasih saksi mata kalau pas christmas eve ada domba di padang.. makanya ane suruh ente kesana pas desember hahahahahaha..

Suhu rata-rata daerah Palestina
Suhu tertinggi jatuh pada bulan Juni atau Juli, sedangkan suhu terendah jatuh pada bulan Januari atau Februari. Suhu rata-rata bulan Desember lebih rendah ketimbang bulan Juni atau Juli, tetapi lebih tinggi ketimbang bulan Januari atau Februari.

Suhu berdampak pada curah hujan. Suhu rata-rata yang lebih tinggi dari 18 derajat
Celsius membawa curah hujan yang rendah, sehingga mengakibatkan bulan-bulan kemarau.
Rata-rata suhu yang rendah, yaitu antara 9 sampai 18 derajat Celcius membawa curah hujan yang tinggi, sehingga mengakibatkan bulan-bulan penghujan. Curah hujan berhubungan erat dengan rumput. Perhatikan rumput dan postur hewan dalam bulan hujan dalam klip yang diambil di padang Betlehem.

Domba pada bulan Desember di Betlehem gemuk-gemuk karena melimpahnya rerumputan yang bergizi tinggi




Saya berani katakan bahwa ARTIKEL DIATAS adalah BOHONG...!!
Ketika saya mengunjungi JERUSALEM dan BETLEHEM (jarak Betlehem dari Jerusalem sekitar 10 Km)..... dan waktu itu adalah AHIR OKTOBER....cuaca emang sudah sedikit SEJUK... Daerah Betlehem ini berbukit bukit, dan bukan tanah datar apalagi ada padang rumput...tanah yang kering bercampur kerikil...hanya memungkinkan TANAMAN BUAH ZAITUN yang tumbuh..dan emang...Buah Zaitun banyak tumbuh di Betlehem..


Artikel sih boleh aja ngambil dari mana mana...tapi kalo bicara JERUSALEM dan BETLEHEM...saya sudah menginjakkan kaki disana...

nih ane kasih lagi!!

Halfway there, we passed a young shepherd by the side of the road watching a small flock of sheep on a hill. We decided we needed a break so climbed the hill, said “Hi” to the shepherd, and sat down to eat some snacks.

I think we all thought it was quite funny to actually see sheep and a shepherd in this otherwise developed area. 2,000 years and some things haven’t changed!

http://simplefollower.com/2011/12/29/christmas-eve-in-bethlehem-2011/

tuh ada gambar dombanya!! di saat natal!! hahahahahahahaha...

susah kalau ama orang ga pakai otak..

kurang apa mang? pengalaman ente yg oktober atau pengalaman orang di saat natal dan ada fotonya yang ane percaya? hahahahahahahhaha..

Taun berapa mereka maen ke Betlehem...???
Apakah CUACA dari jaman Yesus sampe sekarang TETAP...???

Perakiraan cuaca yang dibuat di abad Milenium aja ngatain begini..
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bethlehem

Climate
Bethlehem has a Mediterranean climate, with hot and dry summers and cold winters. Winter temperatures (mid-December to mid-March) can be cold and rainy. January is the coldest month, with temperatures ranging from 1 to 13 degree Celsius (33–55 °F). From May through September, the weather is warm and sunny. August is the hottest month, with a high of 30 degrees Celsius (81 °F). Bethlehem receives an average of 700 millimeters (28 in) of rainfall annually, 70% between November and January.[52]

Data diatas adalah penjelasan cuaca yang dibuat pada abad Milinium...apalagi 2000 tahun yang lalu ketika jaman Yesus masih idup...cuaca bisa lebih ekstrim lagi..

AHIR DESEMBER dengan cuaca yang TERAMAT SANGAT DINGIN....para koboy koboy menggembalakan kambingnya dimalam hari...???

Sungguh suatu PENDAPAT YANG DIPAKSAKAN hanya untuk MEMPERTAHANKAN IMAN yang.......RAPUH...!!!

emang cuaca bisa berubah sampai berapa derajat mang? ga mutu bener ente mang!!

toh 9 derajat juga merujuk jaman itu. bukan jaman sekarang. kalau sekarang berapa mang? hehehehe..

Tetep aja...pengalaman saya ketika sampe AHIR NOVEMBER kapal masih sailing di Laut Mediteranean....siang hari dengan langit biru dan matahari bersinar cerah....DINGINNYA DAH MINTA AMPUN...
Apalagi AHIR DESEMBER pas malam hari...

Cuman KOBOY KAMBING YANG GILA yang gembalain kambing pada AHIR DESEMBER....MALAM hari pulaaa...

maklum ente keturunan "hitam" jadi ya gitu deh. ane di sydney suhu 10 derajat juga ga masalah mang. apalagi kayak gembala yang udah biasa ama cuaca disana. ente payah bener mang!

Masalah tanggal emang bukan hal yang mendasar...yang jadi ACUAN UTAMA adalha...bahwa TOKOH TOKOH PAGAN DILAHIRKAN pada WINTER SOLTICE...yaitu kalo diitung dengan penanggalan Masehi yang berlaku sekarang antara tanggal 21-24 Desember.

Tokoh tokoh Pagan yang hidup ribuan taun sebelum Yesus...tentunya gak pake Kalender Masehi...tapi SAAT WINTER SOLTICE itulah yang jadi acuannya...dan kelahiran Yesus inipun...diperingati pada 25 Desember adalah WINTER SOLTICE...

Masalah WINTER SOLTICE inilah yang coba anda HINDARKAN untuk dibahas...

heran ane mang.. ngapain ane menghindar? wong ada dasar kok menghindar!! hahahahahahahaha..
kalau ga ada alasana baru ane menghindah hahahahahahahahaha..

Saya bukan MEMFITNAH...tapi sekedar BERBAGI INFORMASI...bahwa AKIDAH KRISTEN adalah COMOTAN DARI PAGANISME....
Dan referensi yang saya ambil pun bukan dari kalangan Muslim...

Selama anda MAMPU UNTUK BERTAHAN...silahkan BANTAH BUKTI BUKTI SEJARAH yang akan saya sodorkan terkait AKIDAH PAGANISME yang dipake Kristen...

Biar pembaca yang menilainya....INFORMASI KEPAGANAN dari "mang odoy"....atow bantahan dari "ramayana"...

kan gitu..??

lha mana? apa akidah kristen yang niru paganisme???? apakah natal itu akidah?? apakah 25 desember itu pagan?? hahahahahahahahaha...

silahkan kasih deh, mana akidah pagan itu??

sekali lagi mang ane kasih tau. tanggal 25 desember ada dasarnya!!

hayoooo...RAMAYANA SANG JAGOAN...maju lagii ahhh.....si SEGOROWEDI dan OGLIKOM dah mulai NGACAY di lapak sebelah...sekarang giliran nt lagi yang kena KEFYET MIYING nya "mang odoy"....


tarriiikkk jjabbbriigggg....!!!

sorry ya mang.. bukan menghina. ente masih kelas bawah mang.. ente hanya kayak putra mentari. omong ga bisa mikir. sekali lagi sorry lho mang. mengatakan kenyataan emang kadang pahit mang dengernya hahahahahahaha..

Yesus dilahirkan dianggap adalah tahun 1 masehi! walaupn hitungan ini kurang akurat, tetapi karena memang hitungan jaman dahulu memakai ini, maka dasar inilah yang kita pakai.

mang ane nanya.. apakah natal itu akidah kristen? ayo mang silahkan dikasih terjemahannya hehehehe..

ane ga akan mundur mang. tinggal kasih intinya aja kok pura pura ga ada waktu krn lg terjemahin hahahahaha..

lha nete nulis panjang panjang itu buat apa diatas??.

mang odoy wrote:@ramayana

Yesus dilahirkan dianggap adalah tahun 1 masehi! walaupn hitungan ini kurang akurat, tetapi karena memang hitungan jaman dahulu memakai ini, maka dasar inilah yang kita pakai.

tuhh kannn....panjang lebar nyerocos...akhirnya anda sendiri yang ngaku..


lihat yang saya MERAHIN TEBAL...!!...BIRU GARIS BAWAH..!!

Hujah dari ayat Bible seabreg...tapi PANGKAL nya SERBA GAK PASTI..
Ini sama sajah dengan MENEGAKKAN BENANG BASAH....alias...PERCUMA..

Pope Benedict...yang sekarang dah lungsur keprabon.. mengomentari masalah kelahiran Yesus kaya gini..

http://newsfeed.time.com/2012/11/22/pope-benedict-disputes-jesus-date-of-birth/

Pope Benedict Disputes Jesus’ Date of Birth

Pope Benedict XVI has revealed in the third installment of his trilogy, dedicated to the life of Christ, that Jesus may have been born earlier than previously thought. The calendar we use today, which commences with the birth of Christ and was created by a Dionysius Exiguus, a 6th century monk, may be mistaken. According to the Telegraph, the Pope explains in his book that Exiguus, who is considered the inventor of the Christian calendar, “made a mistake in his calculations by several years. The actual date of Jesus’ birth was several years before.” The suggestion that Jesus wasn’t actually born on Dec. 25 has been tirelessly debated by theologians, historians and spiritual leaders, but what makes this case different is that now the leader of the Catholic Church is the one asking the questions.


Ini yang bikin buku...adalah POPE BENEDICT lhoo mass....
Bukan RAMAYANA yang bisanya cuman copas....apalagi SEGOROWEDI yang becusnya cuma SMS..

Ntar lah...kalo proyek terjemahan saya dah beres...semuanya bakalan KLIR..bahwa AKIDAH KRISTEN ini COPASAN PAGANISME MESIR...
Ini logis sekali...secara BANI ISRAEL dulunya adalah BUDAK FIR'AUN sebelum akhirnya dibawa hijrah oleh Nabi Musa..
Nahh...doktrin doktrin Paganisme Mesir ini lah...yang dipake oleh kaum Yahudi yang emang sangat membenci Nabi Isa/Yesus...untuk MEMFITNAH NABI ISA SEPANJANG JAMAN.....maka jadilah NABI YESUS sebagai PENGGANTI DEWA MATAHARI...."HORUS" sang putra "OSIRIS" dan emaknya bernama "ISIS"...cuman ganti nama doang...makna pengkultusannya sama aja...

mang ane nanya.. apakah natal itu akidah kristen? ayo mang silahkan dikasih terjemahannya hehehehe..

NATALIS INVICTUS...sudah jelas adalah budaya PAGAN PENYEMBAH DEWA MATAHARI...
Dewa Mithra Romawi hanyalah copasan dari PERSIA....tapi ntar kalo terjemahan saya dah beres...ternyata semua BERSUMBER dari PAGANISME MESIR....ini logis..secara MESIR adalah KEBUDAYAAN PALING TUA di dunia...dan faham PENYEMBAH DEWA MATAHARI..adalah datang nya dari MESIR.... Persia,Babilonia, Yunani dan ROmawi....hanyalah copasan dari MESIR...

ditunggu aja....biar tambah greget sama mang odoy....

ane ga akan mundur mang. tinggal kasih intinya aja kok pura pura ga ada waktu krn lg terjemahin hahahahaha..

BAGUS...kalo anda emang TIDAK AKAN PERNAH MUNDUR...itu yang saya mau...karena anda di tret ini akan jadi CEMILAN saya buat terus NGEBONGKAR KEPAGANAN KRISTEN....yang nyata nyata hanya COPASAN dari PAGANISME MESIR....dan ini adalah FITNAH SEPANJANG JAMAN yang diderita oleh Nabi Isa/Nabi Yesus dari Nazareth....

lha nete nulis panjang panjang itu buat apa diatas??.

sekadar pemanasan aja....iklan kalo boleh dibilang...show time belon dimulai...biar penonton pada GREGET...

ramayana wrote:

mang odoy wrote:@ramayana

Yesus dilahirkan dianggap adalah tahun 1 masehi! walaupn hitungan ini kurang akurat, tetapi karena memang hitungan jaman dahulu memakai ini, maka dasar inilah yang kita pakai.

tuhh kannn....panjang lebar nyerocos...akhirnya anda sendiri yang ngaku..


lihat yang saya MERAHIN TEBAL...!!...BIRU GARIS BAWAH..!!

Hujah dari ayat Bible seabreg...tapi PANGKAL nya SERBA GAK PASTI..
Ini sama sajah dengan MENEGAKKAN BENANG BASAH....alias...PERCUMA..

Pope Benedict...yang sekarang dah lungsur keprabon.. mengomentari masalah kelahiran Yesus kaya gini..

http://newsfeed.time.com/2012/11/22/pope-benedict-disputes-jesus-date-of-birth/

Pope Benedict Disputes Jesus’ Date of Birth

Pope Benedict XVI has revealed in the third installment of his trilogy, dedicated to the life of Christ, that Jesus may have been born earlier than previously thought. The calendar we use today, which commences with the birth of Christ and was created by a Dionysius Exiguus, a 6th century monk, may be mistaken. According to the Telegraph, the Pope explains in his book that Exiguus, who is considered the inventor of the Christian calendar, “made a mistake in his calculations by several years. The actual date of Jesus’ birth was several years before.” The suggestion that Jesus wasn’t actually born on Dec. 25 has been tirelessly debated by theologians, historians and spiritual leaders, but what makes this case different is that now the leader of the Catholic Church is the one asking the questions.


Ini yang bikin buku...adalah POPE BENEDICT lhoo mass....
Bukan RAMAYANA yang bisanya cuman copas....apalagi SEGOROWEDI yang becusnya cuma SMS..

Ntar lah...kalo proyek terjemahan saya dah beres...semuanya bakalan KLIR..bahwa AKIDAH KRISTEN ini COPASAN PAGANISME MESIR...
Ini logis sekali...secara BANI ISRAEL dulunya adalah BUDAK FIR'AUN sebelum akhirnya dibawa hijrah oleh Nabi Musa..
Nahh...doktrin doktrin Paganisme Mesir ini lah...yang dipake oleh kaum Yahudi yang emang sangat membenci Nabi Isa/Yesus...untuk MEMFITNAH NABI ISA SEPANJANG JAMAN.....maka jadilah NABI YESUS sebagai PENGGANTI DEWA MATAHARI...."HORUS" sang putra "OSIRIS" dan emaknya bernama "ISIS"...cuman ganti nama doang...makna pengkultusannya sama aja...

mang ane nanya.. apakah natal itu akidah kristen? ayo mang silahkan dikasih terjemahannya hehehehe..

NATALIS INVICTUS...sudah jelas adalah budaya PAGAN PENYEMBAH DEWA MATAHARI...
Dewa Mithra Romawi hanyalah copasan dari PERSIA....tapi ntar kalo terjemahan saya dah beres...ternyata semua BERSUMBER dari PAGANISME MESIR....ini logis..secara MESIR adalah KEBUDAYAAN PALING TUA di dunia...dan faham PENYEMBAH DEWA MATAHARI..adalah datang nya dari MESIR.... Persia,Babilonia, Yunani dan ROmawi....hanyalah copasan dari MESIR...

ditunggu aja....biar tambah greget sama mang odoy....

ane ga akan mundur mang. tinggal kasih intinya aja kok pura pura ga ada waktu krn lg terjemahin hahahahaha..

BAGUS...kalo anda emang TIDAK AKAN PERNAH MUNDUR...itu yang saya mau...karena anda di tret ini akan jadi CEMILAN saya buat terus NGEBONGKAR KEPAGANAN KRISTEN....yang nyata nyata hanya COPASAN dari PAGANISME MESIR....dan ini adalah FITNAH SEPANJANG JAMAN yang diderita oleh Nabi Isa/Nabi Yesus dari Nazareth....

lha nete nulis panjang panjang itu buat apa diatas??.

sekadar pemanasan aja....iklan kalo boleh dibilang...show time belon dimulai...biar penonton pada GREGET...

ya elah mang!! ente punya akal mbok dipakai!

kan ente bilang kalau penetapan itu krn pagan. dan ane kasih ada perhitungannya. bukan masalah salah atau benar!! ane sekedar kasih bukti hitungan yang ente minta!

dan lagi, natal itu peringatan! ga memperingati juga ga masuk neraka! apalagi kita ga masalahin masalah tanggal, ortodok pakai tanggal 6 januari kita juga ga masalah. ada gereja ga rayain natal juga ga masalah.

ini hanya peringatan. apakah natal itu akidah kristen??

ente kok ga jawab dari dulu. mana akidah yg nyontek pagan? natal?? hahahahahahaha..

masalah pope.. kita jug atahu semua. lha ane aja bilang kok ada kesalahan. tapi kan bukan itu yang penting. ini sekedar perayaan. mau di ganti juga ga masalah. inilah bukti kejujuran agama kita.

gimana agama ente? akui ada masalah di quran yg dibakar? sampai hadits juga banyak yg bahas..

pakai akal budi mang..

mang odoy wrote:

PERSAMAAN CREED/KREDO KRISTEN DENGAN PAGANISME MESIR KUNO

1. Kelahiran SANG JURU SELAMAT "HORUS" di saat WINTER SOLTICE.

It needs to be understood that the Egyptian stories were never ―laid out‖ in a linear form; rather, they appear in bits and pieces in primary sources such as the Pyramid Texts, Coffin Texts and Book of the Dead, compiled and altered over many centuries, beginning as early as 7,000 years ago. Thus, it is a common misconception that the myths unfold in the same linear manner as in the Christian narrative. Most of these motifs are indeed not linear narratives, but, rather, symbolic associations derived from different Egyptian texts, as well as later mythographers‘ accounts. Since this description of Horus here is obviously angled from the reference point of the Christian narrative, the subject needs to be deconstructed and reconsidered from the standpoint of each motif, rather than the overall narrative. The Christian story must, in turn, likewise be considered from the standpoint of each individual motif and not linearly, because this basic ―mythicist‖44 argument is that the Christian religion is a compilation of religious motifs which existed previously—and separately.

Haruslah dimengerti bahwa kisah/dongeng di Mesir tidak pernah disajikan dalam bentuk linear, kebanyakan kisah kisah tersebut muncul sepotong sepotong dalam sumber utama semisal Teks teks Piramid, tulisan di peti mati dan dalam buku Book of the Dead, dikompilasi dan diedit selama berabad abad, dimulai skitar 7000 tahun yang lalu, oleh karenanya,adalah sebuah miskonsepsi yang umum bahwa mitos mitos tersebut dibeberkan dengan cara yang sama sebagaimana narasi dalam ke kristenan. Sebagian motif motif ini sebenernya bukan narasi yang lurus/panjang, tapi, lebih kepada, asosiasi simbol yang diambil dari teks teks Mesir yang berbeda, seperti halnya penjabaran penjabaran para Mythographer dikemudian hari. Karena deskripsi tentang "Horus" disini ternyata dilihat dari titik referensi narasi Kristen, subjek subjek ini harus dideskontruksi dan dipertimbangkan kembali dari sudut pandang dari masing masing motif, daripada dari keseluruhan narasi. Dalam girilannya, Kisah kisah kekeristenan harus dipertimbangkan dari sudut pandang dari masing masing motif secara individu dan bukan secara lurus, karena argumen dasar mitos bahwa Agama Kristen adalah sebuah kompilasi dari motif motif agama yang pernah ada sebelumnya dan secara terpisah




Obviously, the English term ―December 25th‖ did not exist in the ancient Egyptian calendar but simply refers to the winter solstice, which the ancients perceived as beginning on December 21st and ending at midnight on the 24th. We learn from one of the most famous historians of the first century, Plutarch (46-120 AD/CE), that Horus the Child—or ―Harpocrates,‖ as was his Greek name—was ―born about the winter solstice, unfinished and infant-like...‖45


Sebenernya, term bahasa Inggis- Desember 25, tidak pernah ada dalam Kalender Mesir Kuno, tapi hanya merujuk ke WINTER SOLTICE, yang mana orang dijaman dulu mempersepsikan sebagai awal dari tanggal 21 Desember dan berakhir pada saat Tengah Malam pada tanggal 24 Desember. Kita belajar dari salah satu pakar sejarah di abad pertama yaitu PLUTARCH (46-120 Masehi), bahwa si anak "Horus" atow "Harpocrates" dalam bahasa Yunani nya dilahirkan pada saat WINTER SOLTICE,



2. HORUS Lahir dari Perawan Agung.

As is often the case with mythical figures, despite the way she is impregnated, Isis remained the ―Great Virgin,‖ as she is called in a number of pre-Christian Egyptian writings. As stated by Egyptologist Dr. Reginald E. Witt:
The Egyptian goddess who was equally ―the Great Virgin‖ (hwnt) and ―Mother of the God‖ was the object of the very same praise bestowed upon her successor [Mary, Virgin Mother of Jesus].52

Sebagaimana seringnya kasus yang berkaitan dengan figur mitos, bagaimanapun caranya dia dihamili, Isis tetap sebagai PERAWAN AGUNG, sebagaimana dia disebut dalam sejumlah tulisan Mesir sebelum jaman Krisrten. Hal ini dinyatakan oleh Ahli Sejarah Mesir Dr. Reginald E. Witt.
Dewi dewi Mesir yang sama-Perawan Agung (hwt) dan-Ibu Tuhan/Tuhan Ibu adalah objek yang sama yang mendapatkan pujian anugrah seperti halnya Penerus penerusnya ( Maria, Ibu perawan dari Yesus).


One of the inscriptions that calls Isis the ―Great Virgin‖ appears in the temple of Seti I at Abydos dating to the 13th century BCE, while in later times she is equated with the constellation of Virgo, the Virgin.53 Also, in the temple of Neith and Isis at Sais was an ancient inscription that depicted the virgin birth of the sun

Salah satu inskripsi yang menyebutkan bahwa Isis sang Perawan Agung muncul di Kuil Seti 1 di Abytos yang diperkirakan ada pada abad 13 sebelum Masehi, sementara dikemudian hari dia disamakan dengan Bintang Virgo, sang perawan tersebut juga ada di Kuil Neith dan Isis di Sais, adalah seubah inskripsi kuno yang menggambarkan Kelahiran dewa Matahari dari seorang Perawan.


Concerning the relationship of the Egyptian religion to Christianity, Budge summarizes:
..at the last, when [Osiris‘s] cult disappeared before the religion of the Man Christ, the Egyptians who embraced Christianity found that the moral system of the old cult and that of the new religion were so similar, and the promises of resurrection and immortality in each so much alike, that they transferred their allegiance from Osiris to Jesus of Nazareth without difficulty. Moreover, Isis and the child Horus were straightway identified with Mary the Virgin and her Son, and in the apocryphal literature of the first few centuries which followed the evangelization of Egypt, several of the legends about Isis and her sorrowful wanderings were made to centre round the Mother of Christ. Certain of the attributes of the sister goddesses of Isis were also ascribed to her, and, like the goddess Neith of Sais, she was declared to possess perpetual virginity. Certain of the Egyptian Christian Fathers gave to the Virgin the title ―Theotokos,‖ or ―Mother of God,‖ forgetting, apparently, that it was an exact translation of neter mut, a very old and common title of Isis.
....pada akhirnya, ketika pengkukltusan akan Osiris muncul sebelum agama dari Laki Laki Kristus (Yesus), orang orang Mesir yang memeluk agama Kristen menemukan bahwa sistem Moral dari pengkultusan jaman dulu dan agama yang baru mereka peluk ternyata begitu persis, dan janji janji dari kebangkitan dan keabadian dalam kedua pengkultusan tersebut begitu sama persis, yang pada akhirnya mereka memindahkan KEPATUHAN/KESETIAAN dari Osiris ke Yesus dari Nazareth tanpa kesukaran.
These gods‘ interchangeability is evident from Egyptian texts, such as chapter or spell 69 of the Book of the Dead:
…I am Horus the Elder on the Day of Accession, I am Anubis of Sepa, I am the Lord of All, I am Osiris.35
Kemampuan untuk berganti ganti fungsi ketuhanan in adalah bukti dari tulisan tulisan Mesir, seperti dalam Bab atow ejaan 69 dari "Book of The Dead" :
..... Akulah Horus sang Ketua di Hari Akhir, akulah Anubis dari Sepa, akuah Tuhan dari semuanya, akukah Osiris...

3. Kelahiran "HORUS" dengan dibarengi oleh Bintang di Timur dan dan ketika saat dilahirkan dipuja/disembah oleh tiga orang Raja.
The theme of the newborn savior being signaled by a star and approached by three ―kings‖ or dignitaries has multiple mythological meanings, the prominent astrotheological one of which is summarized by Barbara G. Walker:
Osiris‘s coming was announced by Three Wise Men: the three stars Mintaka, Anilam, and Alnitak in the belt of Orion, which point directly to Osiris‘s star in the east, Sirius (Sothis), significator of his birth.59

Tema bahwa Sang Juru Selamat dilahirkan dengan ditandai oleh bintang dan dihampiri oleh 3 raja atow orang orang yang terkemuka/terpandang (secara pengaruh di masyarakat) mempunyai makna mitos yang ganda, tokoh astrologi yang masyhur yang dimana disimpukan oleh Barbara G.Walker :
Kedatangan Osiris diumumkan oleh 3 orang laki laki bijak : 3 bintang yaitu Mintaka,Anilah dan Alnitak dalam rangkaian bintang Orion, yang mana menunjuk ke bintang Osiris di timur, Sirius (Sothis), signifikator akan kelahirannya

Star in the East: To understand the ―Star in the East,‖ one first needs to recognize the significance of the star Sirius or Sothis, as it is called in Greek. In the words of Dr. Allen:
Sothis (spdt ―Sharp‖). The morning star, Sirius, seen by the Egyptians as a goddess. In Egypt the star disappears below the horizon once a year for a period of some seventy days; its reappearance in midsummer marked the beginning of the annual inundation and the Egyptian year. The star‘s rising was also seen as a harbinger of the sunrise and therefore associated with Horus in his solar aspect, occasionally specified as Horus in Sothis (hrw jmj spdt), Sothic Horus (hrw spdtj), or Sharp Horus (hrw spd).60
Bintang di Timur : Untuk bisa mengerti tentang Bintang di Timur, pertama tama kita harus mengenali makna makna dari bintang Sirius atow Sothis, sebagaimana disebut dalam bahasa Yunani. Menurut Dr.Allen : Sothis (spdt-Tajam). Bintang pagi muncul, yaitu bintang Sirius, dianggap oleh orang Mesir sebagai Dewi (istri Dewa). Di Mesir, bintang tersebut hilang dibawah batas pandang (horizon) yaitu sekali dalam setahun selama 27 hari ; penampakan bintang tersebut pada pertengahan musim panas menandai mulainya banjir tahunan dan tahun bangsa Mesir. Bintang yang terbit juga dianggap sebagai sebuah pertanda dari matahari terbit dan karenanya berhubungan dengan Horus dalam aspek ke matahariannya, adakalanya dispesifikasikan sebagah Horus dalam Sothis (hrw jmj spdt), Sothic Horus (hrw spdtj), atau Sharp Horus (hrw spd).


....tubi kontinyu...

Horus was born to the goddess Isis after she retrieved all the dismembered body parts of her murdered husband Osiris, except his penis which was thrown into the Nile and eaten by a catfish,[6][7] and used her magic powers to resurrect Osiris and fashion a gold phallus[8] to conceive her son.[citation needed] Once Isis knew she was pregnant with Horus, she fled to the Nile Delta marshlands to hide from her brother Set who jealously killed Osiris and who she knew would want to kill their son.[9] There Isis bore a divine son, Horus.

ramayana wrote:@ odoy.

apakah natal adalah akidah kristen??

silahkan jawab yang jelas.. dan bersiaplah jadi bahan tertawaan.

mengenai tanggal, capek ane mang.. udah dikatakan ada alasannya..

apa kalau tanggal sama kemudian dianggap itu nyontek pagan? apa itu dianggap perayaan pagan?

ente ini emang payah mang.. kemren bilang mitra. sekarang horus. besok apa?
apakah Isa juga nyontek mitor horus? hahahahaha..

ane ampe males baca tulisan copas ente.

ane kasih di wiki. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horus

Horus was born to the goddess Isis after she retrieved all the dismembered body parts of her murdered husband Osiris, except his penis which was thrown into the Nile and eaten by a catfish,[6][7] and used her magic powers to resurrect Osiris and fashion a gold phallus[8] to conceive her son.[citation needed] Once Isis knew she was pregnant with Horus, she fled to the Nile Delta marshlands to hide from her brother Set who jealously killed Osiris and who she knew would want to kill their son.[9] There Isis bore a divine son, Horus.

ane males mang. silahkan aja bawa satu satu.. yg mana yg sama ama pagan?

mang odoy wrote:@ramayana

ente ini emang payah mang.. kemren bilang mitra. sekarang horus. besok apa?
apakah Isa juga nyontek mitor horus? hahahahaha..

MITRA-APOLLO atow WUJUD DEWA MATAHARI di berbagai negara lain selain Mesir...hanyalah CONTEKAN dari pengkultusan DEWA MATAHARI di Mesir...

Dan yang masih langgeng sampe sekarang adalah PERWUJUDAN DEWA MATAHAIR dengan inisial YESUS PUTRA MARIA...

ane ampe males baca tulisan copas ente.

ane kasih di wiki. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horus

Horus was born to the goddess Isis after she retrieved all the dismembered body parts of her murdered husband Osiris, except his penis which was thrown into the Nile and eaten by a catfish,[6][7] and used her magic powers to resurrect Osiris and fashion a gold phallus[8] to conceive her son.[citation needed] Once Isis knew she was pregnant with Horus, she fled to the Nile Delta marshlands to hide from her brother Set who jealously killed Osiris and who she knew would want to kill their son.[9] There Isis bore a divine son, Horus.

Lhaa...pan dah diterangna dalam essay yang saya bawa..

As is often the case with mythical figures, despite the way she is impregnated, Isis remained the ―Great Virgin,‖ as she is called in a number of pre-Christian Egyptian writings. As stated by Egyptologist Dr. Reginald E. Witt:
The Egyptian goddess who was equally ―the Great Virgin‖ (hwnt) and ―Mother of the God‖ was the object of the very same praise bestowed upon her successor [Mary, Virgin Mother of Jesus].52

Sebagaimana seringnya kasus yang berkaitan dengan figur mitos, bagaimanapun caranya dia dihamili, Isis tetap sebagai PERAWAN AGUNG, sebagaimana dia disebut dalam sejumlah tulisan Mesir sebelum jaman Krisrten. Hal ini dinyatakan oleh Ahli Sejarah Mesir Dr. Reginald E. Witt.
Dewi dewi Mesir yang sama-Perawan Agung (hwt) dan-Ibu Tuhan/Tuhan Ibu adalah objek yang sama yang mendapatkan pujian anugrah seperti halnya Penerus penerusnya ( Maria, Ibu perawan dari Yesus).

PERAWAN dalam Mitos PAGANISME PENYEMBAH DEWA MATAHARI...bukan berarti pas pemilihan umum jadi janda....abis dipake,perawan lagiii...dipake,perawan lagi...itulah mitos dalam pengkultusan dewa matahari...

Maria ibunya Yesus juga tetep aja disebut PERAWAN SUCI....ya gak..??
Padahal menurut Kristen sendiri...Kue Surabi nya neng Maria yang pernah dipake buat brojolin tuhan semesta alam yang turun ke planet bumi dengan nama Yesus...sudah dipernah dijajal dan DINIKMATI oleh Aki Aki yang namanya YUSUF SI TUKANG KAYU..
Hayoooo......mo ngomong apa lagi kauu..??

Coba baca baik baik, artikel yang anda usung sendiri dari wiki itu...kisahnya persis sama dengan kisah Yesus yang ada di Bible....
Horus dilarikan oleh Ibunya Isis ke sungai Nile karena mau DIBUNUH...ini sama denga kisah Yesus yang dibawa ngabur ke Mesir karena mau DIBUNUH...!!
Diakhir artikel itu disebutkan... There Isis bore a divine son, Horus....disanalah Isis melahirkan seorang ANAK TUHAN...
Sama kan..?? ya emang IYA.... dah dibilangin KRISTEN itu CONTEKAN AGAMA MESIR KUNO pegangannya Firaun...
Dan umat Kristen sekarang adalah DUPLIKATNYA UMAT FIRAUN jaman dulu....

ane males mang. silahkan aja bawa satu satu.. yg mana yg sama ama pagan?

ya ammpyunnnnn....itu artikel kagak dibaca ya....pan disana sudah disebut satu satu...AKIDAH AKIDAH/CREED/KREDO Kristen yang dapet nyontek dari PAGAN MESIR..
Mana BANTAHANNNYA...???
Ngebantah masalah 25 DESEMBER aja dah blepotan jatuh bangun gitu....
Gimana mo ngebantah masalah lainnya..???

Maless..??? atow dah mulai MUNTAH DARAH nihh...???
Ingat..saya bilang ini baru permulaan...kedepannya masih banyak yang akan saya jeplakin..

Sekarang anda sudah makan buah simalakama...maju kena mundur kena..
Anda diem pun...saya akan terus memposting DATA DAN FAKTA tentang KE PAGANAN KRISTEN ini...
Tinggal dipilih....

All About Horus
An Egyptian Copy of Christ?

claim from "Zeitgeist" video to be examined:
"...the character of Jesus, a literary and astrological hybrid, is most explicitly a plagiarization of the Egyptian Sun-god Horus..."

All About Horus: An Egyptian Copy of Christ?

Summary of the Osiris-Isis-Horus Myth
The Birth and Flight of Horus
The Battle Between Horus and Seth
The Horus Gods and Forms
Zeitgeist on Horus
Zeitgeist's Bogus Sources
Astro-Theology and the Bible
The Celtic or Irish Cross
Scholarly Sources on Horus and Egyptian religion
Further Links
Horus, the Egyptian Falcon-god, is "lord of the sky" and a symbol of divine kingship. His name ("Har" in Egyptian) probably means "the high," "the far-off," "the distant one" and is connected with "Hry" ("one who is above/over"). The name appears on Egyptian hieroglyphs in the royal protocol at the very beginning of dynastic civilization (c. 3000 BC).



The roles, local cult foundations, and titles or epithets of Horus are sometimes correlated with distinct or preferred forms in iconography: for example, the falcon or falcon-headed man, the winged disk, the child with a sidelock of hair (sometimes in his mother's arms). Egyptologists therefore often speak of distinct Horuses or Horus-gods (see Oxford Encyclopedia, vol 2, "Horus" p. 119ff; and Hart, Routledge Dictionary of Egyptian gods and goddesses, "Horus" p. 70ff).

In ancient Egypt several gods are known by this name, but the most important was the son of Osiris and Isis, identified as king of Egypt. To repeat what I summarized elsewhere: Osiris is the oldest son of Geb ("earth" personified) and Nout or Nut ("mother of the gods" and goddess of the sky), the husband of Isis, whose myth was one of the best known and whose cult was one of the most widespread in pharaonic Egypt. The mythology of Osiris is not preserved completely from an early date, but the essentials are related by Plutarch in On Isis and Osiris (De Iside et Osiride).

With the rise of the full-blown Osiris-Isis-Horus myth, the living king was identified as an earthly Horus and the dead king (his father/predecessor) as Osiris. When the king died, he became Osiris, and Horus is his royal heir and successor. The most common geneology of Horus is as the son of Osiris and Isis, making a tenth on the family tree of the Heliopolitan Ennead. But the full picture is more complex: Hathor (herself identified with Isis) also appears as the mother of Horus; Horus the Elder (Haroeris) can appear in the Heliopolitan family tree as a brother of Osiris and son of Geb and Nut, thus an uncle of Horus in his more usual manifestations. Therefore, Horus and Seth are sometimes described as nephew and uncle, sometimes as brothers. In a battle over the throne of Egypt, Horus fought with Seth, and despite losing an eye, was successful in avenging the death of his father Osiris, becoming his legitimate successor.

The textual and mythological materials relating to Horus are extremely rich, comprising hymns, mortuary texts, ritual texts, dramatic/theological texts, stories, the Old Coptic and Greek so-called magical papyri, and the most complete ancient exposition of the Osiris narrative, Plutarch's De Iside et Osiride (in Latin translation). In characteristic Egyptian fashion, many of the hymns, mortuary, and ritual texts incorporated substantial narrative material or are taken from narrative, although they are not comprehensive, consecutive myths per se. In addition to Plutarch's account in Greek, the most substantial sources for the Osiris-Isis-Horus cycle include the following (see Oxford Encyclopedia, vol 2, "Horus" p. 121ff):

the Memphite Theology or Shabaqo Stone (generally dated as late as the New Kingdom, c. 1540-1070 BC);
the Mystery Play of the Succession;
the Pyramid Texts (from the late Old Kingdom, c. 2575-2150 BC);
the Coffin Texts, especially Spell 148;
the Great Osiris hymn in the Louvre;
the Late Egyptian Contendings of Horus and Seth;
the Metternich Stela and other cippus texts;
the Ptolemaic Myth of Horus at Edfu (also known as the Triumph of Horus);
These texts take us with a number of variations and contrasting perspectives, from the conception and birth of Horus, through his childhood hidden in the marshes, his protection by Isis, his conflict with Seth and his followers, and his succession as legitimate king. The "Myth [or Triumph] of Horus" is preserved in the Temple of Edfu, inscribed on the inner faces of the east and west enclosure walls. Previously no complete translation of the various texts which compose it appeared in any language, though the actual texts and reliefs have since been long published by Naville, Textes relatifs au Mythe d'Horus recueillis dans le Temple d'Edfou (Geneva, 1870), then in the magnificent edition of Chassinat, Le Temple d'Edfou (Cairo, 1928-1934), and later in scholarly and popular works by Dieter Kurth, e.g. The Temple of Edfu: a guide by an ancient Egyptian priest (Cairo, 2004). The myth comprises five texts (see Blackman / Lloyd, Gods, Priests, and Men, p. 255ff, in articles by H.W. Fairman), which are:

The Legend of the Winged Disk. The chief actors are Horus of Behdet and Seth. Re and Thoth provide a running commentary and numerous somewhat tedious puns which detract from the flow and interest of the narrative. The language is stilted and formal, and somewhat restricted in vocabulary and forms of expression.
The story of a fight between Horus, son of Isis (who is assisted by Horus of Behdet), and Seth. This portion follows immediately after A.
A dramatized version of the exploits of Horus which was enacted at his festival (not worded in the form of a connected story). After texts referring to the ten harpoons with which Horus attacked his enemy, come songs by the Royal Children and by the princesses of Upper and Lower Egypt together with the women of Mendes (Pe and Dep), and finally two versions of the dismemberment of Seth and the distribution of the parts of his body among various gods and cities.
Seth, son of Nut, assumes the form of a red hippopotamus and goes to Elephantine. Horus, son of Isis, pursues him and overtakes him near Edfu, and after the ensuing fight Seth flees northward and Horus assumes the office of his father.
Horus is mentioned as lord of Lower Egypt, living at Memphis, and Seth as lord of Upper Egypt, living in Shas-hetep. Horus and Seth fight, the one in the form of a youth, the other as a red donkey. Horus finally triumphs and cuts off the leg of Seth. This story is written in a pronounced Late-Egyptian idiom.
Summary of the Osiris-Isis-Horus Myth

In ancient Egyptian tradition, at least as preserved to us, the Osiris-Isis-Horus myth was never recounted as a coherent whole; rather, it served as a source of allusions for a large number of religious texts. It was a sequence of scenes that was unmistakably rooted in the mortuary cult. The only texts that furnish us with a continuous narrative are written in Greek, by Diodorus (1st century BC) and especially by Plutarch (c. 46 - 120 AD). But in their care about a single, meaningful, stimulating story these authors seem to have strayed from the Egyptian form of the myth. The myth has both a prehistory and a starting point. The prehistory is not narrated in the Egyptian texts, yet it is necessary for all that follows (see Jan Assman, Death and Salvation in Ancient Egypt, p. 23).



The basic Egyptian myth goes like this: Osiris became ruler of the land, but was tricked and slain by his jealous brother, Seth. According to the Greek version of the story, Typhon (Seth) had a beautiful coffin made to Osiris' exact measurements, and with 72 conspirators at a banquet, promised it to the one who would fit it. Each guest tried it for size, and Osiris was the one to fit exactly. Immediately Seth and the conspirators nailed the lid shut, sealed the coffin in lead, and threw it into the Nile. The coffin was eventually borne across the sea to Byblos, where Isis, who had been continually searching for her husband, finally located it. She returns the body to Egypt where Seth discovers it, cuts the corpse into pieces, and scatters them throughout the country. Isis transforms herself into a kite, and with her sister Nephthys, searches for and finds all the pieces (except the male member, which she replicates), reconstitutes the body, and before embalming to give Osiris eternal life, she revivifies it, couples with it, and thus conceives Horus.

"Of the parts of Osiris's body the only one which Isis did not find was the male member, for the reason that this had been at once tossed into the river, and the lepidotus, the sea-bream, and the pike had fed upon it; and it is from these very fishes the Egyptians are most scrupulous in abstaining. But Isis made a replica of the member to take its place, and consecrated the phallus, in honour of which the Egyptians even at the present day celebrate a festival." (Plutarch, Moralia V, On Isis and Osiris, 18)

According to the principal version of the story cited by Plutarch, Isis had already given birth to her son, but according to the Egyptian Hymn to Osiris, she conceived him by the revivified corpse of her husband.

Osiris' rule plays a great role in Egyptian texts. They almost always speak of him as ruler of the realm of the dead, an office he assumed only as a dead god, and almost never about his earthly kingship, which he exercised over gods and men in the world above as successor of Geb. Osiris' reign came to a violent end as he was slain by his brother, Seth. Later Horus avenges his father Osiris' death and succeeds him without completely destroying Seth. Thus did death come into the world, confronting the gods with a great problem. This is the prehistory of which there is no coherent narrative in the Egyptian texts (see Jan Assmann, p. 24).

The Birth and Flight of Horus

The slaying and dismemberment of Osiris, and his re-joining and rejuvenation by his wife Isis, is a common theme of a large corpus of texts, which do not actually describe it but rather presuppose it as the trigger for various actions whose aim is to cope with this catastrophe. Just as it was Osiris' undoing that he was the first of the divine rulers to have a brother and thus a rival for the throne, so his sisters became his "salvation." Isis, his sister-wife, was the first to take action by traversing the land to collect his scattered body parts.



A Hymn to Osiris from Dynasty 18 (stela Louvre C 286) narrates her actions in the form of two scenes: (1) Isis' search and her care for the body; and (2) the conception, birth, and childhood of Horus.

Isis the powerful, protectress of her brother, who sought him tirelessly,
who traversed this land in mourning and did not rest until she found him;
who gave him shade with her feathers and air with her wings;
who cried out, the mourning woman of her brother
who summoned dancers for the Weary of Heart;

who took in his seed and created the heir,
who suckled the child in solitude, no one knew where,
who brought him, when his arm was strong,
into the hall of Geb -- the Ennead rejoiced:

"Welcome, Osiris' son, Horus, stout of heart, justified, son of Isis, heir of Osiris."

(Hymn to Osiris, Dynasty 18, stela Louvre C 286; from Jan Assmann, p. 24-25)

Isis' activities with regard to the corpse of Osiris culminate in the posthumous conception of Horus. In the accounts of Greek historians Diodorus and Plutarch, Isis recovers all the body parts of the slain god except for his virile member, which had been swallowed by a fish. She was thus obliged to replace this member with an artificial one that she uses as an instrument for her posthumous insemination to produce Horus. Although the Egyptian texts seldom mention this scene, the locus classicus (classical passage) is from the Pyramid Texts (Spell 366):

Isis comes to you, rejoicing for love of you,
that her seed might issue into her, it being sharp as Sothis.

Horus, the sharp one, who comes forth from you
in his name "Horus, who is in Sothis,"
may it be well with you through him
in your name "Spirit in the dndrw-barque."

Horus has protected you in his name "Horus protector of his father."

(Pyramid Texts, Spell 366; from Jan Assmann, page 25)

Here is some commentary on the "conception of Horus" from various Egyptian scholars:

"...drawings on contemporary funerary papyri show her as a kite hovering above Osiris, who is revived enough to have an erection and impregnate his wife." (Lesko, Great Goddesses of Egypt, p. 162)
"After having sexual intercourse, in the form of a bird, with the dead god she restored to life, she gave birth to a posthumous son, Horus." (Dunand / Zivie-Coche, Gods and Men in Egypt, p. 39)
"Through her magic Isis revivified the sexual member of Osiris and became pregnant by him, eventually giving birth to their child, Horus." (Richard Wilkinson, Complete gods and goddesses of Ancient Egypt, p. 146)
"Isis already knows that she is destined to bear a child who will be king. In order to bring this about, she has to revive the sexual powers of Osiris, just as the Hand Goddess aroused the penis of the creator to create the first life." (Pinch, Handbook of Egyptian Mythology, p. 80)
In short, this was NO "virgin birth" as is clear also from repeated references to Osiris' "seed." A "miraculous birth" perhaps because it involves a dead and then revived husband, but not a virginal conception (sometimes wrongly called an "immaculate conception" -- that has to do in Catholic theology with Mary's conception without Original Sin, not Jesus' conception) nor a virgin birth as contained in the Bible (cf. Matthew 1:18-25; Luke 1:26-38).

A longer passage is from the Coffin Texts (Spell 148) which describes the birth and flight of Horus (as the Falcon god), and has further references to Osiris' "seed":

TAKING SHAPE AS A FALCON. The lightening flash strikes, the gods are afraid, Isis wakes pregnant with the seed of her brother Osiris. She is uplifted, (even she) the widow, and her heart is glad with the seed of her brother Osiris. She says:

"O you gods, I am Isis, the sister of Osiris, who wept for the father of the gods, (even) Osiris who judged the slaughterings of the Two Lands. His seed is within my womb, I have moulded the shape of the god within the egg as my son who is at the head of the Ennead. What he shall rule is this land, the heritage of his (grand-) father Geb, what he shall say is concerning his father, what he shall kill is Seth the enemy of his father Osiris. Come, you gods, protect him within my womb, for he is known in your hearts. He is your lord, this god who is in his egg, blue-haired of form, lord of the gods, and great and beautiful are the vanes [feathery part of plume as distinct from the stem] of the two blue plumes."

"Oh!" says Atum, "guard your heart, O woman!"

"[Isis says:] How do you know? He is the god, lord and heir of the Ennead, who made you within the egg. I am Isis, one more spirit-like and august than the gods; the god is within this womb of mine and he is the seed of Osiris."

Then says Atum: "You are pregnant and you are hidden [allusion to pregnant Isis hiding in the marshes of Chemmis], O girl! You will give birth, being pregnant for the gods, seeing that he is the seed of Osiris. May that villain who slew his father not come, lest he break the egg in its early stages, for the Great-of-Magic will guard against him."

Thus says Isis: "Hear this, you gods, which Atum, Lord of the Mansion of the Sacred Images, has said. He has decreed for me protection for my son within my womb, he has knit together an entourage about him within this womb of mine, for he [Atum] knows that he [Horus] is the heir of Osiris, and a guard over the Falcon who is in this womb of mine has been set by Atum, Lord of the gods. Go up on earth, that I may give you praise [said to the unborn Horus]. The retainers of your father Osiris will serve you, I will make your name, for you have reached the horizon, having passed by the battlements of the Mansion of Him whose name is hidden. Strength has gone up within my flesh, power has reached into my flesh, power has reached...." [there is a textual omission at this point]

"...who conveys the Sunshine-god, and he has prepared his own place, being seated at the head of the gods in the entourage of the Releaser." [unidentifiable speaker, probably either Isis or Atum]

"[Isis speaks to her son who has now been born:] O Falcon, my son Horus, dwell in this land of your father Osiris in this your name of Falcon who is on the battlements of the Mansion of Him whose name is hidden. I ask that you shall be always in the suite of Re of the horizon in the prow of the primeval bark for ever and ever."

Isis goes down to the Releaser who brings Horus, for Isis has asked that he may be the Releaser as the leader of eternity.

"See Horus, you gods! [Horus proclaims his power] I am Horus, the Falcon who is on the battlements of the Mansion of Him whose name is hidden. My flight aloft has reached the horizon, I have overpassed the gods of the sky, I have made my position more prominent than that of the Primeval Ones. The Contender [Seth] has not attained my first flight, my place is far from Seth, the enemy of my father Osiris. I have used the roads of eternity to the dawn, I go up in my flight, and there is no god who can do what I have done. I am aggressive against the enemy of my father Osiris, he having been set under my sandals in this my name of.... [meaning unknown]. I am Horus, born of Isis, whose protection was made within the egg; the fiery blast of your mouths does not attack me, and what you may say against me does not reach me, I am Horus, more distant of place than men or gods; I am Horus son of Isis."

(Egyptian Coffin Text, Spell 148, translation found in The Ancient Egyptian Coffin Texts, volume 1, p. 125-127, by R.O. Faulkner; another translation with commentary can be found in Myth and Symbol in Ancient Egypt by R.T. Rundle Clark, p. 213-217)

This text begins with the dark days immediately after the death of Osiris, when Seth and his henchmen are tyrannizing over the world. Horus assumes control of his own destiny. He appears as a falcon and soars up into the sky beyond the flight of the original bird-soul, beyond the stars (the "gods of Nut") and all the divinities of olden time whose souls inhabit the constellations. In so doing he brings back light and the assurance of a new day, thus subduing Seth, who personifies the terrors of darkness and death. The opening section moves within the main Osiris myth, but this disappears when Isis suddenly realizes she will give birth, not to a child, but to a falcon. Isis dreams prophetically that the child quickening in her womb will grow up to restore the rightful order of the world. In a new scene, the birth is about to take place, Isis comes forward to Atum who is surrounded by his divine courtiers. Finally, Horus is born and flys up of his own accord (see Clark, Myth and Symbol in Ancient Egypt, p. 213ff).

There were two primary gods called Horus: the first was the original falcon who flew up at the beginning of time -- the most ancient bird -- and the other was the son of Isis and heir to Osiris. They are compounded in this Coffin Text. Instead of being born in the Delta swamps and growing up in secret, Horus is offered a place in the sun's boat, but he transcends both his earthly fate and that as a subordinate to Re. He flies up and across the night sky of the Underworld to land on the edge of the world, bringing with him the twilight that comes just before full day. The old belief is that Horus was the leader of the decanal stars which circled around the sky in the path of the sun. The appearance of Horus just before dawn is the mark of a new year, and the world's great age begins anew (see Clark, p. 216-217).

The Battle Between Horus and Seth

As early as the Old Kingdom it was envisaged that Horus wrested the kingship of Egypt from the god Seth: Horus takes his father's house from his father's brother Seth. Horus then triumphs over his paternal uncle. However there is a conflation of the two myths because in the Osiris cycle, Osiris and Seth were brothers, while in an independent tradition Horus and Seth were brothers feuding for the throne. Normally Horus is the ascendant, but the supporters of Seth were never completely suppressed (indicating perhaps as the meaning of the myth, that evil will always be with us, and we must be vigilant).



Seth, the embodiment of disorder, was predominantly seen as a rival of Horus, a would-be usurper who assassinated Osiris and was defeated. However, Seth was also portrayed in a balance with Horus, so that the pair represented a bipolar, balanced embodiment of kingship. Thus, on the side of the throne, Horus and Seth -- symmetrical and equal -- tie the papyrus and lotus around the sema-sign (sm3 = "unity"; also the end of the Thutmose III Poetical Stela). From the Shabaqo Stone in the British Museum, a copy of an original document from the Pyramid Age carved in Dynasty XXV, there is a concise statement of the dispute between Horus and Seth. The god Geb is the judge and makes a preliminary decision to divide Egypt between the protagonists: Seth will be king of Upper Egypt and Horus will rule over Lower Egypt, the border being the "Division of the Two Lands", i.e. the apex of the Nile Delta at Memphis where Osiris is said to have drowned. On reflection Geb revises this judgment awarding the whole inheritance of Egypt to Horus. It is stressed that this result is amicably accepted -- the reed of Seth and papyrus of Horus being attached to the door of the god Ptah to symbolize that they were pacified and united.

A fuller and more scandalous description of the trial survives in Papyrus Chester Beatty I written in the reign of Ramesses V (Dynasty XX). The sun-god in this tribunal is not sympathetic to Horus' case to be ruler of Egypt, dismissing him as a youngster with halitosis and preferring the older claimant Seth. Horus pleads that he is being defrauded of his lawful patrimony. Then occurs a series of episodes involving Horus and Seth, each trying to outwit the other and win over the court. In one contest, the two gods are hippopotamuses who intend to see if they can remain submerged under water for three months. Isis refuses to take this opportunity of killing Seth with a harpoon. Horus, enraged, savagely attacks his mother and escapes into the desert. Seth finds him and cuts out both his eyes. Hathor, using gazelle's milk, restores Horus' eyes.

On another occasion Seth suggests a race in boats of stone. Horus secretly builds a vessel of pine covered with plaster to imitate stone. Seth's boat of 36 meters of solid stone, sinks and he turns himself into a hippo. Horus is prevented from slaying Seth by the other gods.

Since the beginning of the 20th century in Egyptological research, much debate has ensued over whether the struggle between Horus and Seth was primarily historical/geo-political, or cosmic/symbolic. When the full Osiris complex became visible, Seth appears as the murderer of Osiris and would-be killer of the child Horus. The symbolism of Horus' eventual triumph over Seth (e.g. the pharaoh cutting the throat of an oryx or spearing a turtle) permeates many temple reliefs. It also lies behind the gilded wooden statuette of Tutankhamun standing on a papyrus boat, lasso in one hand, harpoon in the other: the king is in the act of spearing the hippo Seth (see Oxford Encyclopedia, vol 2, "Horus" p. 120; Hart, Routledge Dictionary, "Horus" p. 72-73).

In the battle between Horus and Seth (which lasts 80 years), despite losing an eye, Horus is successful in avenging the death of his father Osiris, becoming his legitimate successor. The injury inflicted by Seth on the eye of Horus is alluded to in the Pyramid Texts where royal saliva is prescribed for its cure. The restored eye of Horus becomes, in singular form, the symbol for a state of soundness or perfection -- the "udjat" eye (the whole or sound "eye of Horus"). It can also stand for the strength of the monarch; the concept of kingship; protection against Seth; royal purification agent; offerings at the festival of the waxing moon wine, etc. Its iconography consists of a human eye with the cosmetic line emanating from its corner, below it are the markings of a falcon's cheek. As an amulet the "udjat" was placed in mummy wrappings or worn on a necklace. In the Middle Kingdom, it was painted on the sides of rectangular coffins (Hart, p. 73).

Osiris becomes king of the (dead) underworld, and Horus the king of the living. As mentioned, Horus is usually represented as a falcon, or as a sky god whose outstretched wings filled the heavens; his sound eye was the sun, and injured eye the moon.

The Horus Gods and Forms

Horus is one of the earliest attested of the major ancient Egyptian deities, becoming known as early as the late Pre-dynastic period (Naqada III / Dynasty 0; c. 3200-3000 BC). The earliest documented chapter in the career of Horus was as Horus the falcon, god of Nekhen (Hierakonpolis) in southern Upper Egypt. In this capacity Horus was the patron deity of the Hierakonpolis monarchy that grew into the historical pharaonic state, hence the first known national god, the god of kingship. He was still prominent in the latest temples of the Greco-Roman period (c. 300 BC - 300+ AD), especially at Philae and Edfu as well as Old Coptic and Greco-Egyptian ritual-power or magical texts.

Horus the falcon was predominantly a sky god and a sun god; as the former his eyes are the sun and moon, as the latter, he has a sun disk on his head and is syncretized with the sun-deity Re (or Ra), most often as Re-Harakhty. Horus the falcon/disk had the epithet "Great God, Lord of Heaven, Dappled of Plumage." Three main forms of Horus are as the Child, as the Son of Isis, and as a sun-god.

Horus the Child
In the Pyramid Texts the god is once called "Horus the child with his finger in his mouth." This aspect refers to his birth and upbringing in secret by his mother Isis. Born at Khemmis in the northeast Delta, the young god was hidden in the papyrus marshes, hence his epithet Har-hery-wadj or "Horus who is upon his papyrus plants." This appears visually in a wall relief in the temple of Sety I (Dynasty XIX) at Abydos as a hawk on a column in the shape of a papyrus reed.

From the Egyptian Har-pa-khered literally "Horus-the-child" the Greeks created the name of Harpokrates. In this form Horus is depicted as a young vulnerable-looking child, sitting on the knees of Isis, wearing the sidelock of youth and sometimes sucking his fingers. In the Late Dynastic cippi objects, Harpokrates acts as an amuletic force warding off dangerous creatures. Horus as a boy with the sidelock appears dominating crocodiles, serpents, and other noxious animals on cippi or apotropaic stelae of "Horus-on-the-Crocodiles," the common manifestation of the importance of Horus in healing ritual and popular ritual practice. The healing of Horus from scorpian stings by Isis provided the reason for the production of the cippi of Horus and his role in healing.

The Harsomtus version of Horus can be traced back to the Pyramid Texts as Har-mau or "Horus the uniter." The idea is the king as upholder of the unification of North and South Egypt. Since in temple dogma the divine child of a god and goddess could be thought a manifestation of the pharaoh, Harsomtus is used merely as "filling" in a sacred triad. He is e.g. the son of the elder Horus and Hathor at Edfu temple. Similarly at the temple of Kom-Ombo the same couple are the parents of Harsomtus under the name of Pa-neb-tawy or "lord of the Two Lands."

Horus the child / Horus son of Isis and Osiris was often portrayed as a boy wearing the sidelock and frequently appeared in the arms of his mother Isis. Bronzes representing him, with or without Isis, were ubiquitous in Late and Greco-Roman times. On cippi, the head of the child Horus was often surmounted by a full-faced Bes-head or mask.

Horus the Son of Isis (and Osiris)
The Harsiese ("Horus, the son of Isis") form emphasizes his legitimacy as the offspring of the union of Isis and Osiris. In the Pyramid Texts, Harsiese performs the vital "opening the mouth" ceremony of the dead king, a ritual that restored faculties to the corpse for their Afterlife, and was carried out at the time of the burial by the successor-monarch (or Horus). A typical pictorial of this rite being performed by one pharaoh upon another can be found on the wall of the sarcophagus chamber in the tomb of Tutankhamun (Dynasty XVIII).

Another funerary priestly title, Horus Iun-mutef, or "pillar of his mother" is evocative of Horus' success in regaining the throne of his father Osiris, because of Isis' careful upbringing of her son. At funeral ceremonies the eldest son of the deceased -- or a mortuary priest -- dressed in panther skin, played the role of Horus Iun-mutef burning incense and scattering purified water before the coffin.

The Har-nedj-itef or "Horus the savior of his father" (Greek Harendotes) refers to Horus' vindication of his claim to succeed Osiris, rescuing his father's former earthly domain from the usurper Seth.

Horus as sun-god
As a cosmic deity Horus is imagined as a falcon whose wings are the sky, right eye is the sun, left eye the moon. From the reign of King Den (Dynasty I), on an engraved ivory comb, the hawk's wings as an independent entity covey the celestial imagery while a hawk in a boat suggests the journey of the sun-god himself. Textual evidence from the Pyramid Era refers to Horus as "lord of the sky" or as a god "of the east"; i.e. the region of sunrise.

The form Harakhti or "Horus of the horizon" refers to the god rising in the east at dawn to bathe in the "field of rushes." The Pyramid Texts mention this aspect of the god linked to the sovereign: the king is said to be born on the eastern sky as Harakhti. Also since the element -akhti can be a dual form of the noun akhet (horizon), there is a play on words when the king is given power over the "two horizons" (i.e. east and west) as Harakhti.



Naturally the Egyptians had to accept that technically their pharoah, as "son of Re" (or Ra) the sun-god, could not achieve a total identification with this aspect of Horus, especially with the coalescence of this form with the Heliopolitan sun-god to become as Re-Harakhty (or Ra-Harakhti). Thus Senwosret I (Dynasty XII) was appointed "shepherd of this land" by Harakhti. In laudatory or propagandist inscriptions the assimilation of the pharaoh to Harakhti is maintained, as for instance in the case of the Sudanese King Piye (Dynasty XXV) on his stela commemorating the conquest of Egypt.

"Horus of Behdet" or the Behdetite was normally shown as a hawk-winged sun disk with pendant uraei (snakes). The location of Behdet was in the marshy north-east Delta. It is not mentioned in the Pyramid Texts and the antiquity of the site as a cult centre of Horus (in relation to Edfu) cannot yet be ascertained. It becomes an ubiquitous motif -- e.g. in temple decorations of ceilings or gate lintels, or the upper border or frame of wall-reliefs or the lunette of stelae.

The form Har-em-akhet or Harmachis (Harmakhis) or "Horus in the horizon" aptly regionalizes Horus as sun-god. Pharaonic inscriptions of the New Kingdom reinterpreted the Great Sphinx at Giza, originally representing King Khafra guarding the approach to his pyramid, as Harmachis looking towards the eastern horizon.

Aside from the sun disk, Horus in various forms also wore the Double Crown, a status as king of Egypt; the atef (a type of crown); triple atef; and a disk with two plumes, etc. There are also ancient localities with a Horus cult. The two most important sanctuaries in terms of historical and archaeological evidence belong to Horus of Nekhen and Horus of Mesen.

By the fifth dynasty (2498 - 2345 BC), the Horus-king also became "son of Re" the sun god by personifying mythologically the entire older genealogy of Horus as the goddess Hathor, or "house of Horus" who was also the spouse of Re and mother of Horus. Horus was also combined, syncretized, and closely associated with deities other than Re, notably (but not exclusively) Min, Sopdu, Khonsu, and Montu. The Greeks associated Horus with Apollo giving rise to the author of the Hieroglyphica, Horapollo.

While Egyptologists often speak of distinct Horus-gods, combinations, identifications, and differentiations were possible, and they are complementary rather than antithetical. A judicious examination of the various "Horuses" and the sources relating to them supports the possibility that the roles in question are closely interrelated, so they may be understood as different aspects or facets of the same divine persona (see Oxford Encyclopedia, vol 2, "Horus" p. 119ff; Hart, Routledge Dictionary, "Horus" p. 70ff).

"Zeitgeist" on Horus

"By this we know the spirit of truth and the spirit of error." (1 John 4:6, Douay-Rheims)

Now I will respond to the transcript section of "Zeitgeist" that talks about Horus and Jesus. I have removed the transcript's references, although I will talk about the film's sources at the end. My own documentation, information, and sources are contained above, with a short bibliography at bottom.

From the transcript of www.ZeitgeistMovie.com in red.

This is Horus. He is the Sun God of Egypt of around 3000 BC.

Horus is not (simply) the sun god, although that became one of his forms. Horus in ancient Egypt was the falcon god whose name means the high, far-off, or distant one. Re (or Ra) was the sun god who came to be identified with the mid-day (or noon) sun. Horus was also the sky god, whose good or sound eye was the sun, and injured eye the moon.

He is the sun, anthropomorphized, and his life is a series of allegorical myths involving the sun's movement in the sky.

He is not the sun, but came to be identified with the position of the rising sun (the sun rises in the east), in such Greek forms as Harakhti = "Horus of the horizon"; and Harmachis (-khis) = "Horus in the horizon." Later he was associated with the sun-god Re and known as Re-Harakhti. Atum was the god of the setting sun.

From the ancient hieroglyphics in Egypt, we know much about this solar messiah. For instance, Horus, being the sun, or the light, had an enemy known as Set and Set was the personification of the darkness or night.

It is hieroglyphs, not hieroglyphics. Hieroglyphic is an adjective (e.g. hieroglyphic writings). The term "messiah" comes from the Hebrew Moshiach for "Anointed One." It is a Judaeo-Christian concept; it does not go back to ancient Egypt. Set (or Seth) was Horus' brother, or in other versions, his uncle. In one tradition of the Egyptian myth, Seth was Horus' rival (and usurper of Egypt's throne), in others, his balance (a bipolar, balanced embodiment of kingship). As mentioned above: since the beginning of the 20th century in Egyptological research, much debate has ensued over whether the struggle between Horus and Seth was primarily historical/geo-political, or cosmic/symbolic. When the full Osiris complex became visible, Seth appears as the murderer of Osiris and would-be killer of the child Horus.

Ra (Re) was the sun god and creator of the universe
Osiris was the king of the underworld (the dead), wife of Isis, and father of Horus
Isis was the sister and wife of Osiris, and mother of Horus
Seth was brother and killer of Osiris
Horus, represented by the Falcon symbol, was the son of Osiris and Isis
Ra-Harakhti (Re-Harakhti) or simply Harakhti is "Horus of the two horizons"
See Jim Loy's Egyptian Gods page for the Hierglyphs and names of all the major gods of Egypt.
And, metaphorically speaking, every morning Horus would win the battle against Set - while in the evening, Set would conquer Horus and send him into the underworld. It is important to note that "dark vs. light" or "good vs. evil" is one of the most ubiquitous mythological dualities ever known and is still expressed on many levels to this day.

Horus was never sent to the underworld. That was Osiris who was killed and became lord of the underworld (i.e. the dead), while Horus was king of the living. In one version of the myth, Horus battles with Seth over an 80 year period, the earth-god Geb in a judgment awards the whole inheritance of Egypt to Horus, and Horus then becomes ruler of Egypt. From then on, the dead Egyptian king becomes an "Osiris", and his successor the living king is a "Horus." That is the primary meaning of the Horus-Seth battle myth. In the Egyptian Coffin Texts (Spell 148, quoted above), Horus appears as a falcon who soars up into the sky beyond the flight of the original bird-soul, beyond the stars and all the divinities of olden time whose souls inhabit the constellations. In so doing he brings back light and the assurance of a new day, thus subduing Seth, who personifies the terrors of darkness and death.

Broadly speaking, the story of Horus is as follows: Horus was born on December 25th

Wrong. The Persian/Roman god Mithras came to be seen as born on that date, as did Jesus later in the early Church. The December 25th date is not found in the Gospels or the New Testament. It was a later adoption by the Catholic Church: "In the first half of the fourth century AD the worship of the Sol Invictus was the last great pagan cult the Church had to conquer, and it did so in part with the establishment of Christmas...At the head of the Deposition Martyrum of the so-called Roman Chronograph of 354 AD (the Philocalian Calendar) there is listed the natus Christus in Betleem Judaeae ('the birth of Christ in Bethlehem of Judea') as being celebrated on December 25. The Deposition was originally composed in 336 AD, so Christmas dates back at least that far." (See "Santa or Satan: Reply to a Funny Fundy")

The date of the birth of Horus according to some online sources is during the Egyptian month of Khoiak (which corresponds to our November month). The Egyptian calendar had three seasons, each four months and 30 days/month. The season of Akhet is months (in Greek) Thot, Phaophi, Athyr, Khoiak; the season of Peret (or Winter) is months (in Greek) Tybi, Mekhir, Phamenoth, Pharmouthi; the season of Chemou (or Summer) is months (in Greek) Pakhon, Payni, Epiph, Mesorê. See online sources: Egyptian Festival Calender ; Egyptian calendar months and seasons ; Grand Festivals ; Festival Rituals. We also know where Horus was supposedly born (at Khemmis or Chemmis in the Nile Delta of northern Upper Egypt).

of the virgin Isis-Meri.

Wrong again. Her name was simply Isis (in Greek). Her true Egyptian name is transliterated simply A-s-e-t or 3st (all woman names in Egyptian end with the "t"). Her name (Aset) means "seat" or "throne" (Oxford Encyclopedia, vol 2, "Isis" p. 188) and "the goddess's name is written in hieroglyphs with a sign that represents a throne, indicating the crucial role that she plays in the transmission of the kingship of Egypt" (Hart, Routledge Dictionary, "Isis" p. 80).



And she definitely was not a virgin when she conceived Horus with the revivified Osiris, if these words mean anything: "[Osiris was] revived enough to have an erection and impregnate his wife" (Lesko, p. 162); "After having sexual intercourse..." (Dunand / Zivie-Coche, p. 39); "revivified the sexual member of Osiris and became pregnant by him" (Richard Wilkinson, p. 146); "revive the sexual powers of Osiris" (Pinch, p. 80).

A virgin birth, or more properly, a virginal conception, is by definition non-sexual.

His birth was accompanied by a star in the east

No evidence any stars are mentioned in the birth of Horus.

which in turn, three kings followed to locate and adorn the new-born savior

There are no "three kings" in the birth of Horus, and there are no "three kings" in the Bible either. Read Matthew 2 for yourself:

"Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem, saying, 'Where is he that is born King of the Jews? For we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him.'" (Matthew 2:1-2 KJV)

They are not called "kings" but "wise men" -- and they are not three in number, we don't know how many there were. Three gifts are later mentioned (gold, frankincense, myrrh) in verse 11, and these were equated with the wise men. Perhaps we are thinking of the Christmas carol "We three kings of Orient are...." ? Nice tune and lyrics, but it's always best to cross-check with the biblical text.

At the age of 12, he was a prodigal child teacher

There is a form known as "Horus the Child" but he wasn't a prodigal teacher. He was kept hidden away by his mother, until he was ready to be ruler of Egypt. The young god was hidden in the papyrus marshes, hence his epithet Har-hery-wadj or "Horus who is upon his papyrus plants."

and at the age of 30 he was baptized by a figure known as Anup and thus began his ministry

No evidence of any baptism for Horus, and no evidence of any "ministry" of Horus. Anubis (or Anup or Anpu) means Royal Child, and is usually depicted as jackal-headed or a wild dog-headed man, or a reclining black jackal. Anubis was the great protector god, guiding the soul through the underworld. He was also the Lord of embalming, and through this is connected with incense and perfumery. No baptism here. (See The Jackal Headed God or Egyptian Animal Gods).

Horus had 12 disciples he traveled about with

Horus had NO 12 disciples he traveled with: remember he became ruler of Egypt after a long battle with Seth. Perhaps you could call all the subjects in Egypt his "disciples" (which means followers).

There were technically the "Followers of Horus [son of Isis]" called the Shemsu Heru, mentioned in the Liturgy of Funeral Offerings and purification ceremony. These were a group of beings who were closely connected with Osiris, and having "followed" him in this world they passed after him into the Other World (of the dead), where they became his ministrants and messengers. There were also followers (a different group) of Horus the Elder called the Mesentiu who are "workers in metal" or blacksmiths (see The Liturgy of Funeral Offerings, the fourth ceremony, commentary by Budge).

performing miracles such as healing the sick and walking on water

There are some healing "miracles" or magic associated with Horus, but this is with Horus the Child, not Horus the Elder or his adult forms. In the Late Dynastic cippi objects, Harpokrates (Horus-the-child) acts as an amuletic force warding off dangerous creatures such as crocodiles, serpents, and other noxious animals, etc. "Horus-on-the-Crocodiles" was a common manifestation of the importance of Horus in healing ritual. The healing of Horus from scorpian stings by Isis provided the reason for the production of the cippi of Horus and his role in healing. The power of this healing seems to come from his mother, Isis, who was indeed the "goddess of immense magical power" (Hart, Routledge Dictionary, "Isis" p. 79ff).

Horus was known by many gestural names such as The Truth, The Light, God's Annointed Son, The Good Shepherd, The Lamb of God, and many others

Wrong, no evidence for these names. The "forms" of the Horus-god are precisely what I listed above, under these categories: Horus the Child (healing / magical titles such as "Horus-on-the-Crocodiles"); Horus as son of Isis and Osiris ("pillar of his mother"; "savior of his father"); and Horus as a sun-god ("lord of the sky"; god "of the east"; Horus of / in "the horizon"; and later associated with Re).

After being betrayed by Typhon, Horus was crucified, buried for 3 days, and thus, resurrected.

Typhon is also known as Seth, his rival brother (or uncle). Horus was NOT crucified, was NOT buried for 3 days, and thus, was NOT resurrected. Your sources are wrong. In some versions of his battle with Seth, Horus had one or both of his eyes injured, but he was not killed. It was his father Osiris who was killed, dismembered, reconstituted, and revived by Isis, his magical mother.

These attributes of Horus, whether original or not, seem to permeate in many cultures of the world, for many other gods are found to have the same general mythological structure

No, they do not. They are unique to Jesus Christ (crucifixion, burial, bodily resurrection). I have demolished these claims in my long, detailed, documented article "Evidence for Jesus and Parallel Pagan 'Crucified Saviors' Examined."

Attis of Phyrigia, born of the virgin Nana on December 25th, crucified, placed in a tomb and after 3 days, was resurrected.

Wrong. See my section on Attis for the facts.

Krishna of India, born of the virgin Devaki with a star in the east signaling his coming, performed miracles with his disciples, and upon his death was resurrected.

There is some magic and a resurrection/ascension associated with Krishna. Otherwise, wrong.

Dionysus of Greece, born of a virgin on December 25th, was a traveling teacher who performed miracles such as turning water into wine, he was referred to as the "King of Kings," "God's Only Begotten Son," "The Alpha and Omega," and many others, and upon his death, he was resurrected.

Again, wrong. See my section on Dionysos for the facts.

Mithra of Persia, born of a virgin on December 25th, he had 12 disciples and performed miracles, and upon his death was buried for 3 days and thus resurrected, he was also referred to as "The Truth," "The Light," and many others. Interestingly, the sacred day of worship of Mithra was Sunday.

Wrong. See my section on Mithras for the facts.

The fact of the matter is there are numerous saviors, from different periods, from all over the world, which subscribe to these general characteristics.

The fact of the matter is, your "sources" are lying to you. Get some better sources. Go to a university library. Do some research. It's not really that hard.

The question remains: why these attributes, why the virgin birth on December 25th, why dead for three days and the inevitable resurrection, why 12 disciples or followers?

No questions remain. These are unique to Jesus Christ. See my article, especially the last section "Christianity vs. Pagan 'Mystery' Religions."

Furthermore, the character of Jesus, a literary and astrological hybrid, is most explicitly a plagiarization of the Egyptian Sun-god Horus.

Totally wrong and demolished above. We'll get to some of the "astrology" material below.

For example, inscribed about 3500 years, on the walls of the Temple of Luxor in Egypt are images of the enunciation, the immaculate conception, the birth, and the adoration of Horus. The images begin with Thaw announcing to the virgin Isis that she will conceive Horus, then Nef the holy ghost impregnating the virgin, and then the virgin birth and the adoration. This is exactly the story of Jesus' miracle conception.

The "enunciation" should be the "Annunciation" (March 25 is the feast day in Catholic liturgical calendars), and "immaculate conception" refers to the Catholic teaching about Mary's conception without Original Sin (December 8 is the feast day), not to a virginal conception. Just to be clear: Mary's own conception and birth from her mother was normal in the biological sense; it was Jesus who was virginally conceived and virgin born (Matthew 1:18-25; Luke 1:26-38).

"Horus yang diurapi atow yang dibaptis, tulisan tulisan Pyramid W 51/PT 77:52a-b mengatakan :
Ointment, ointment, where should you be? You on Horus‘s forehead, where should you be? You were on Horus‘s forehead...84

ramayana wrote:

mang odoy wrote:@ramayana

ente ini emang payah mang.. kemren bilang mitra. sekarang horus. besok apa?
apakah Isa juga nyontek mitor horus? hahahahaha..

MITRA-APOLLO atow WUJUD DEWA MATAHARI di berbagai negara lain selain Mesir...hanyalah CONTEKAN dari pengkultusan DEWA MATAHARI di Mesir...

Dan yang masih langgeng sampe sekarang adalah PERWUJUDAN DEWA MATAHAIR dengan inisial YESUS PUTRA MARIA...

ane ampe males baca tulisan copas ente.

ane kasih di wiki. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horus

Horus was born to the goddess Isis after she retrieved all the dismembered body parts of her murdered husband Osiris, except his penis which was thrown into the Nile and eaten by a catfish,[6][7] and used her magic powers to resurrect Osiris and fashion a gold phallus[8] to conceive her son.[citation needed] Once Isis knew she was pregnant with Horus, she fled to the Nile Delta marshlands to hide from her brother Set who jealously killed Osiris and who she knew would want to kill their son.[9] There Isis bore a divine son, Horus.

Lhaa...pan dah diterangna dalam essay yang saya bawa..

As is often the case with mythical figures, despite the way she is impregnated, Isis remained the ―Great Virgin,‖ as she is called in a number of pre-Christian Egyptian writings. As stated by Egyptologist Dr. Reginald E. Witt:
The Egyptian goddess who was equally ―the Great Virgin‖ (hwnt) and ―Mother of the God‖ was the object of the very same praise bestowed upon her successor [Mary, Virgin Mother of Jesus].52

Sebagaimana seringnya kasus yang berkaitan dengan figur mitos, bagaimanapun caranya dia dihamili, Isis tetap sebagai PERAWAN AGUNG, sebagaimana dia disebut dalam sejumlah tulisan Mesir sebelum jaman Krisrten. Hal ini dinyatakan oleh Ahli Sejarah Mesir Dr. Reginald E. Witt.
Dewi dewi Mesir yang sama-Perawan Agung (hwt) dan-Ibu Tuhan/Tuhan Ibu adalah objek yang sama yang mendapatkan pujian anugrah seperti halnya Penerus penerusnya ( Maria, Ibu perawan dari Yesus).

PERAWAN dalam Mitos PAGANISME PENYEMBAH DEWA MATAHARI...bukan berarti pas pemilihan umum jadi janda....abis dipake,perawan lagiii...dipake,perawan lagi...itulah mitos dalam pengkultusan dewa matahari...

Maria ibunya Yesus juga tetep aja disebut PERAWAN SUCI....ya gak..??
Padahal menurut Kristen sendiri...Kue Surabi nya neng Maria yang pernah dipake buat brojolin tuhan semesta alam yang turun ke planet bumi dengan nama Yesus...sudah dipernah dijajal dan DINIKMATI oleh Aki Aki yang namanya YUSUF SI TUKANG KAYU..
Hayoooo......mo ngomong apa lagi kauu..??

Coba baca baik baik, artikel yang anda usung sendiri dari wiki itu...kisahnya persis sama dengan kisah Yesus yang ada di Bible....
Horus dilarikan oleh Ibunya Isis ke sungai Nile karena mau DIBUNUH...ini sama denga kisah Yesus yang dibawa ngabur ke Mesir karena mau DIBUNUH...!!
Diakhir artikel itu disebutkan... There Isis bore a divine son, Horus....disanalah Isis melahirkan seorang ANAK TUHAN...
Sama kan..?? ya emang IYA.... dah dibilangin KRISTEN itu CONTEKAN AGAMA MESIR KUNO pegangannya Firaun...
Dan umat Kristen sekarang adalah DUPLIKATNYA UMAT FIRAUN jaman dulu....

ane males mang. silahkan aja bawa satu satu.. yg mana yg sama ama pagan?

ya ammpyunnnnn....itu artikel kagak dibaca ya....pan disana sudah disebut satu satu...AKIDAH AKIDAH/CREED/KREDO Kristen yang dapet nyontek dari PAGAN MESIR..
Mana BANTAHANNNYA...???
Ngebantah masalah 25 DESEMBER aja dah blepotan jatuh bangun gitu....
Gimana mo ngebantah masalah lainnya..???

Maless..??? atow dah mulai MUNTAH DARAH nihh...???
Ingat..saya bilang ini baru permulaan...kedepannya masih banyak yang akan saya jeplakin..

Sekarang anda sudah makan buah simalakama...maju kena mundur kena..
Anda diem pun...saya akan terus memposting DATA DAN FAKTA tentang KE PAGANAN KRISTEN ini...
Tinggal dipilih....

hehehe, ente mau adu ama netter lain? lha ente sendiri aja pandangan beda beda? Isa itu Yesus kagak?

ane punya pandangan beda ama paus sekalipun ga ngurus! wong ane punya dasar. dan udah ane kasih ke ente! kurang apa lagi? ane belepotan???? ngadepin ente?? hahahahahaha.

kisah padang dan domba di betlehem saat tgl 25 ane kasih foto!! kurang apa??

apa ane harus percaya ente yg datang di bulan okt??

juga perhitungan bulan desember.

http://www.philvaz.com/apologetics/HORUS.htm

ente baca sendiri!

tuh semua pertanyaan ente di jawab!

termasuk ini.

Horus was known by many gestural names such as The Truth, The Light, God's Annointed Son, The Good Shepherd, The Lamb of God, and many others

Wrong, no evidence for these names. The "forms" of the Horus-god are precisely what I listed above, under these categories: Horus the Child (healing / magical titles such as "Horus-on-the-Crocodiles"); Horus as son of Isis and Osiris ("pillar of his mother"; "savior of his father"); and Horus as a sun-god ("lord of the sky"; god "of the east"; Horus of / in "the horizon"; and later associated with Re).

== ada yang lucu..

"Horus yang diurapi atow yang dibaptis, tulisan tulisan Pyramid W 51/PT 77:52a-b mengatakan :
Ointment, ointment, where should you be? You on Horus‘s forehead, where should you be? You were on Horus‘s forehead...84



kenapa ga ente translate? hahahahahaha..

=== daripada ente capek capek terjemahin yang ga mutu, ente bawa deh.. 1 aja yang paling pagan!!!!